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Author Topic: Need help on ice/tt build  (Read 9077 times)

Offline Allison#51

Need help on ice/tt build
« on: September 07, 2015, 05:55:34 PM »
I'm in the early stages of planning out my next build and would like some help with deciding what parts to use. When I built my MX quad i was able to do a lot of research and decide exactly what I wanted to do but with this I'm finding there isn't a ton of info on TT, flat track, and ice type setups out there so any input you guys give me can influence the direction this build will go. I'll be using it mostly for ice oval racing but I Might try out some dirt track racing in the summer as well. I have some good ideas on color schemes and parts that will really set this thing off but my main focus right now is to figure out the suspension setup and what I'm thinking is a little different than your average TT build. So far I'm leaning towards the no link KOQ swingarm. I think stock length will work better for me because with my tire setup I don't think I will struggle that much to find traction and my riding style is a little different in the way that I like to drive the quad into the corner hard and steer through it instead of pitching it sideways and driving through it with the throttle. I've never rode a no link or seen many no link setups for oval racing so if I'm far off in my thinking that it will be the way to go I want you guys to tell me. Another part of it will be talking to some shock builders to see if they think they can build a good shock for it. For the front setup I have some LTR spindles that I want to run. In order to make them work whatever a arm I go with will need a normal type upper balljoint in order to clear the rim. My roll design upper heims wouldn't clear. The spindles also really narrow it up so I'm thinking +3's and another important thing to me is that they have good castor adjustment so I'm leaning towards Housers with the slicast adjustment. I'm excited to be able to go a step further with weight cutting on this build and like my MX quad there won't be any details overlooked. It will probably be slow progress and I know TT quads aren't probably everyone's favorite but I'm hoping I can get members involved and excited about something positive instead of all the negative things going on in the community. This will be a .org build if you will and it will be raced as much as possible. No garage queen.

Offline Allison#51

Need help on ice/tt build
« Reply #1 on: September 07, 2015, 06:09:32 PM »
Here is what we're starting with guys

Just a 88 frame for now but it will be on the same level as my MX build if not better because I learned a lot building this one

Offline FerrinMotorsports

Need help on ice/tt build
« Reply #2 on: September 07, 2015, 06:49:23 PM »
The reason for shortening the swing arm for TT/ flattrack isn't only for better traction but it also lets the quad pivot better in the turn....The no-link is one of the best setups for flattrack there is IMO...Curious why the LTR spindles?

Offline Allison#51

Need help on ice/tt build
« Reply #3 on: September 07, 2015, 07:09:46 PM »
Quote from: FerrinMotorsports;58182
The reason for shortening the swing arm for TT/ flattrack isn't only for better traction but it also lets the quad pivot better in the turn....The no-link is one of the best setups for flattrack there is IMO...Curious why the LTR spindles?

I wouldn't mind going a little shorter then stock. I actually went a bit shorter then stock on my MX quad I just don't want to do it to the extreme like -4. I like the gull wing style too cause I plan on running Kyles airbox when he finishes that up. Who else makes a no link for the 250R? Lonestar possibly? The LTR spindles are the hot setup now. I think it's because they're so narrow the effect of the bump steer is reduced.

Offline FerrinMotorsports

Need help on ice/tt build
« Reply #4 on: September 07, 2015, 08:11:26 PM »
I run 400ex spindles to reduce weight with a custom LSR +2 Heim setup.  If the castor/camber is setup correctly bump steer is zero
I have a couple no link swingarms if your interested...

Offline Allison#51

Need help on ice/tt build
« Reply #5 on: September 07, 2015, 09:32:52 PM »
Quote from: FerrinMotorsports;58187
I run 400ex spindles to reduce weight with a custom LSR +2 Heim setup.  If the castor/camber is setup correctly bump steer is zero
I have a couple no link swingarms if your interested...

Pm sent

Offline Allison#51

Need help on ice/tt build
« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2015, 10:02:26 PM »
I have the 400 ex spindles as well on my MX setup and I like them I'm just left wondering if there's more to be had and I have the LTR spindles already so I'd like to give them a try.  I've been seeing where a lot of guys are claiming that the 450r Honda spindles are a better setup than the 400ex too. I don't have the means to really figure out the geometry of them I just know all of the big aftermarket suspension companies are designing their a arms around the LTR spindle now. Im not sure if it will be correct for my setup but if all else fails I'll just go back to the 400ex and yfz calipers setup.

Offline hickwheeler

Need help on ice/tt build
« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2015, 10:46:19 PM »
This may be a dumb question. But I don't know. Should you have a no link frame to go with a no link swingarm
88 hybrid 431 puma
88 (BOF Build) stock motor and oem 89 plastics
More in the works

Offline Allison#51

Need help on ice/tt build
« Reply #8 on: September 07, 2015, 11:32:52 PM »
Quote from: hickwheeler;58196
This may be a dumb question. But I don't know. Should you have a no link frame to go with a no link swingarm

I don't have much experience with no links so maybe someone else can chime in but my understanding of it is that you can run most no link swingarms on a stock chassis if you remove the lower linkage mount off the frame. Most of the aftermarket no link chassis have a raised upper shock mount to utilize a longer body shock which I'm guessing would give you more travel and or be easier to tune in. I think the extra travel would help you for MX, dune, or woods riding.  For ice racing you don't need a lot of travel so the shorter shock should be sufficient. The benefit would be weight savings and I think they can be kind of hit or miss but once the shock is tuned in it will handle better then the stock linkage setup.

Offline Tbone07

Need help on ice/tt build
« Reply #9 on: September 08, 2015, 12:04:21 AM »
The LTR spindles might not help you out if the rest of the setup isn't matched to them. I'm assuming the stem flag and a-arms would have to be altered to make use of the superior design of the LTR spindles.

I know when I talked to Jake from Six5Design he mentioned that he offered two different 450r front end kits, one designed for 450r and one for LTR spindles. So i'm guessing there's some geometry difference between the two kits. If you go through the hassle of getting the LTR setup it might not benefit you. Someone more qualified than me would have to confirm that though
LED Performance 350R
Laegers-JD Performance-GThunder-HLS-PEP-HiPer-GBC

RIP Laz

Offline Allison#51

Need help on ice/tt build
« Reply #10 on: September 08, 2015, 05:28:24 AM »
Quote from: Tbone07;58199
The LTR spindles might not help you out if the rest of the setup isn't matched to them. I'm assuming the stem flag and a-arms would have to be altered to make use of the superior design of the LTR spindles.

I know when I talked to Jake from Six5Design he mentioned that he offered two different 450r front end kits, one designed for 450r and one for LTR spindles. So i'm guessing there's some geometry difference between the two kits. If you go through the hassle of getting the LTR setup it might not benefit you. Someone more qualified than me would have to confirm that though

I asked Jake a while back and he didn't know for sure but he thought I should try it and said it should work well for me.

Offline Tbone07

Need help on ice/tt build
« Reply #11 on: September 08, 2015, 09:02:44 PM »
Quote from: Allison#51;58215
I asked Jake a while back and he didn't know for sure but he thought I should try it and said it should work well for me.

Cool that's good to know
LED Performance 350R
Laegers-JD Performance-GThunder-HLS-PEP-HiPer-GBC

RIP Laz

Offline kb250r

Need help on ice/tt build
« Reply #12 on: September 08, 2015, 11:40:03 PM »
Allison me and you are in the exact same spot and same stage of the TT build...I should have done more research I order a set of Jd performance a arms for mine..not sure on all the adjustments I need to go back and check on that.. At the gusset and powder stage,ready for a arms and suspension..this thread will help up both through this journey..I'm sure jeff(ferrin) and Neil will help navigate the sketchy road...
Atc - 350 6mill
Atc - 350 4mill
Trx - 431 puma

Engineered by C-Leigh Racing

Offline Allison#51

Need help on ice/tt build
« Reply #13 on: September 09, 2015, 05:58:22 PM »
Quote from: kb250r;58266
Allison me and you are in the exact same spot and same stage of the TT build...I should have done more research I order a set of Jd performance a arms for mine..not sure on all the adjustments I need to go back and check on that.. At the gusset and powder stage,ready for a arms and suspension..this thread will help up both through this journey..I'm sure jeff(ferrin) and Neil will help navigate the sketchy road...

Cool! Do you have a build thread up? I plan on gusseting and pro pegging it then I'm doing a full mock up so I can decide what I can remove before pulling it back down for powder coat.

Offline FerrinMotorsports

Need help on ice/tt build
« Reply #14 on: September 09, 2015, 06:09:57 PM »
Jake....Sorry for not getting back to you on the no links....Life is in the way again as far as a minute of free time that is non existent.....I promise you I will get back to you....

 

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