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Author Topic: Jetting from the bottom to the Top - Bill Givens  (Read 3117 times)

Offline rsss396

Jetting from the bottom to the Top - Bill Givens
« on: July 31, 2013, 12:09:31 PM »
link to page http://pstuning.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=545


Bill was a great Kart Engine builder/racer, he unfortunately passed away in 2005


Jetting from the bottom to the top!

To properly jet your carburetor the carb must be clean and with sound  gaskets, seals and o-rings. Vent tubes must be clean and free flowing.  Disassemble and clean the carb and all the passageways with carb cleaner  and compressed air.

The engine must be in sound mechanical and electrical condition with no  air leaks. So… do a compression check along with a pressure check to  make sure you have a good foundation. A new spark plug with the correct  gap and properly set ignition timing is also helpful. You can tune till  you're blue in the face, if you don't have a clean carb, with a  mechanically sound engine as a baseline.
 
Both Mikuni and Keihin’s recommended jetting procedure is to start from  the bottom and proceed to the top. A properly set float level is  critical to all circuits in the carburetor and it must be set first. A  simple and fairly accurate method to set the float level… is with the  float bowl removed, tilt the carb body to about a 45° angle and watch  the float needle. Most have a spring-loaded needle… what you are looking  for is the point where the float tab just meets the needle valve,  without compressing it. Continue to tilt the carb to the point where the  spring just barely touches, and then look at the float casting marks  found on most floats. With a properly set float the marks will typically  be parallel to the body of the carburetor. This point is also the point  to take your float level measurement and with the float in this  position the distance should equal the required measurement, per the  manufacture’s specifications. If not… carefully bend the tab that the  float needle rides on to get the correct level.
 
Please remember that we tune each of the carburetor circuits based on  throttle position and not RPM. We also go from the bottom to the top,  because to varying degrees there is a culmination/overlap of mixtures  from one circuit/position to the next one. If these overlaps were not  present and correctly tuned for… you would experience flat spots or bogs  and/or surges as you open the throttle.
Idle to about ¼ throttle opening is primarily controlled by the pilot  circuit and this fuel/airflow continues all the way to WOT… and thus  affects the whole jetting spectrum. This is one of the major reasons  that you jet from the bottom to the top.

1/8 to about 3/8 is controlled by the slide valve cut away.
¼ to about ¾ is controlled by the needle jet and jet needle.
5/8 to WOT is controlled by the main jet.
Note how each circuit overlaps!

An important point to note is that if a particular circuit is either too  rich or too lean… the amount of overlap can shift up/down,  shrink/expand the range that it should normally control. Due to an  engines design characteristics, rider driving technique and a multitude  of other variables… a particular circuit may need to be richer/leaner  than it would be in a different situation. Then an adjustment would have  to be made on either side to make the transition smooth.
 
The transition from one area to the next doesn't have a Red or Green  light…it has a blinking yellow, and just like in driving, you need to  proceed with caution. If you start from the bottom and go up… you’re  tuning for these variables as you open the throttle… allowing the next  step to be more defined. Remember… that’s what we’re looking for… smooth  transition from bottom to top, with the correct mixture ratio. Then as  you roll off the throttle you'll have a smooth transition back down the  range also. This is just as important! A lot of two stroke engines start  to seize shortly after you come out of the throttle, not when you are  WOT! Why… because when you shut off the gas, you also shut off the oil,  and after a long WOT run you have built up a lot of heat, and you need  the gas/oil mixture to protect your piston/cylinder walls.

Now that we have the float level set and have a basic understanding of how the circuits affect each other… let’s just do it!

The pilot circuit is controlled by the pilot jet and air/fuel adjusting  screw. If the adjustment screw is on the engine side of the slide it  controls the fuel, and if it’s on the air cleaner side it controls the  air. Most MX style carburetors have the adjusting screw on the air  cleaner side, so it controls the airflow. A simple way to look at this  circuit is the pilot jet controls the fuel and the air adjusting screw  allows you to add the appropriate amount of air to get the proper  air/fuel mixture.

To tune the pilot circuit… lightly seat the adjusting screw by turning  it clockwise till it just touches the seat. Don’t tighten it too snug or  you might damage the seat or the taper on the end of the adjusting  screw.  Now back it out to a base line setting of 1-½ turns. Warm up the  engine to a normal operating temperature. Adjust the idle speed  adjusting screw so that you are about 500 RPM higher than your normal  idle speed. Make a mental note of the air adjusting screws location, and  slowly turn the adjustment screw in, and then turn it out in 1/8-turn  increments, until you have found the highest idle RPM. Go slowly and let  the RPM stabilize.  Go back and forth a couple of times so that you get  it spot on.  If the circuit is adjusted properly you will have a smooth  idle and the transition from idle to about ¼ throttle will be also be  smooth, with no hesitations or flat spots.

Note how many turns it took on the adjusting screw to get your best idle  speed. If you had to turn the screw more than one turn out from the  baseline of 1½ turns, then the pilot jet is too large and you need to go  down one size on the pilot jet. Now go back through the adjustment  procedure again to get the adjustment screw back to the base line  setting of around 1½ turns out, when you have the best idle. Most  adjustment screws have a taper that works best between 1/2 to 2 1/2  turns. Using this method allows you to make minor air adjustments to  compensate for small changes in weather conditions at the track and  still be in the working range of the air screw taper and spring.
 
The next rung up the ladder is the throttle side cut away, which  controls the amount of air allowed to flow through the carb at throttle  opening in the 1/8th to ½ throttle range with the most affect in the  1/8th to ¼ range. Typically… slide adjustment are not required, but… you  might run in to a situation where you need to change to a leaner or  richer cut away. The higher the number of the slide the more air it will  flow within it’s operational range. Slides are numbered in millimeters  of cut away at the closed throttle position. A number 6 slide has a 6 MM  cut away and a richer number 5 has a 5 MM cut away. While you can  typically adjust the pilot and slide with the engine running and the  vehicle still… a good on the track test is also recommended. Accelerate  out of a slow, first gear corner to give it a good test. The slide works  in close conjunction with the pilot circuit to allow you to transition  to the next tunable area, which is the jet needle and needle jet.

We want a smooth transition from the throttle slide to the main jet.  This transition is controlled by the needle jet and jet needle. When  completed, we want the jet needle’s (more commonly called the needle)  clip to be in the middle position, if possible, for our base line setup.  

The needle is tapered, and has groves cut in one end, to hold a clip.   This clip allows you to change the length of the needle. There are also  small, thin spacers available, that will let you set the needle length  even more precisely, by placing them under the clip.

The needles length, diameter and taper, in conjunction with the needle  jet control the rate of fuel flow in each position of the needle from a  little less than ½ throttle to a little more than ¾ throttle.

Needle jets come in a couple of different styles and of course numerous  jet sizes. The provide additional avenue to fine tune your mid range.   Some tuners find it more convenient to replace the needle jet with one  size richer instead of raising the needle.  This way you don’t have to  take the top off and mess the springs, etc.  This way your needle will  stay in middle clip setting all the time.  Different strokes for  different folks!

Keihin and Mikuni use a different system for numbering their needles and  you need to become familiar with whichever carb you are running. Give  Sudco’s web site a hit and look through their needle info to find out  what might fit your particular situation. You can get the mid range  perfect if you take your time and have a selection of needles and needle  jets, which by the way, is sometimes called an emulsion tube. Sudco  also sell a tuning manual for Mikuni that it great… for about $12.
Anyone looking for a great builder I highly recommend the following.
For CP products dealers I would recommend:
Arlan at LED(site sponsor), Pete Schemberger at Hybrid Engineering, Mat Shearer at Shearer Custom Pipes, Dennis Packard at Packard Racing, and Nate McCoy of McCoys Peformance.

Other great builders I also would recommend: Neil Prichard, Jerry Hall, Bubba Ramsey and James Dodge.

Offline rsss396

Jetting from the bottom to the Top - Bill Givens
« Reply #1 on: July 31, 2013, 12:11:27 PM »
Ok... let's spend some time talking about the big three in needles!

The needle diameter controls the lower end of the mid range jetting...  just above the pilot jet/slide area, and you feel it in the ¼ to ½  throttle range. The setting of the needle diameter is critical to the  engines lower mid range power and drivability. When the needle diameter  is too large or lean… the engine could have a “lean bog” just as it  starts to pull well. When the needle diameter is too rich, you'll  normally suffer a “rich bog” in the ¼ to 1/2 throttle position.
Ok…what’s the difference between a rich bog and a lean bog… A lean bog  is a sudden loss of power with the characteristic  boooooooooooowwwwwwwwww exhaust and intake sound, and if it’s way too  lean… you will not be able to pull through it without letting off of the  throttle a little bit. A rich bog has a much more mellow sound along  with a blubber, stutter feeling and you will typically pull on through  the range… in time. It should be noted that either one of these  situations can be caused by your fuel delivery system or by clogged vent  tubes.

Moving on now to the overall length of the needle. On most needles there  are 5 clip positions. The top clip setting is called the #1 position  and it’s the leanest. The length setting covers a wide range of your mid  throttle jetting, with an emphasis at ½ throttle. The setting of the  needle length is critical to the engines mid range power and  drivability… very similar to the diameter…just a little more up in the  range of the throttle position. When the needle is too long… the engine  could possibly have a “lean bog” in the mid range, and conversely, when  the needle diameter is too rich the machine will normally suffer a “rich  bog” in the mid throttle position.  To richen the circuit you have to  raise the needle by lowering the clip.

The needle taper is the angle of the needle at its lower half.  This  part of the needle fits into the main jet.  The taper works the  transition between the midrange and full throttle/main jet  (approximately ¾ throttle position). The taper also affects to a small  degree, the main jet size your carburetor requires. A leaner needle  taper will use a richer main jet than a comparable engine/carburetor  combo with a richer needle taper.

Selecting the proper needle takes some time but the rewards are a stronger, smooth power flow and great drivability.

The best way to select the needle is to start with the one that came  with your carb.  Then determine what area of the needle needs to be  changed, if any. Place the needle clip in the middle position and make  sure that the main jet is a size or two larger than you think will be  the final size. Then make some runs at various mid throttle settings to  get a feel for what needs to be changed. Some carburetors don’t have a  replaceable needle jet. On those that do… it is a very effective tuning  device, as you can make small adjustments in the needle jet to get a  centered needle clip.

The main jet is selected in a process similar to the needle. Select a  size that you feel is a little large and make some WFO high speed runs  in 5th or 6th gear and then do a good plug chop to see which way, if any  you need to adjust. Plug reading is a Black Art… that requires some  experience in determining the condition of not only jetting, but also  ignition timing and the overall condition of your engine. This is  covered in another article.

Run a few laps with varying throttle position and verify that the carb  flows smoothly from the bottom to the top. If any area needs  fine-tuning… make the adjustments. This is the seat of the pants method.   Now let’s talk about a better method that will help you out when the  weather conditions change…cause they certainly will!!!!

One of the better carb tuning aids available is EGT monitoring.    Exhaust Gas Temperature is typically measured in the expansion chamber,  at a point about 6 inches from the face of the piston.  The position of  the probe is important in obtaining an accurate reading.   If you look  at the header burn pattern you will typically see a coloration  difference in the first 3-6 inches of the pipe and you want to be just  to the right of the darker area.

EGT is a relative number to your specific engine, and will vary from  engine design to engine design.  You will see lots of numbers used, but  you have to find what number your engine produces.  A higher compression  ratio or timing that is advanced will tend to produce EGT’s that are  lower than the 1200° that a lot of people use…including myself.   Depending upon the engine characteristics your max EGT may only be 1100°  and to be on the safe side you would need to run an EGT of 1000°.   Don’t get caught up with the number so much as the method.

To understand how you can use EGT to tune by, you need to be brought up  to speed on some important factors.   One of which is that if you were  to look at a graph of EGT, you would see a bell curve.  This curve would  show that the EGT rises to a peak and then starts to decline.  On the  left side of the peak, we are richer than stoichiometric, and on the  right side of the peak, we are leaner.   This temperature curve is  controlled by the air/fuel ratio and will peak at a stoichiometric ratio  of 14.7 parts of air to 1 part gasoline.  

Stoichiometric who/what???  The combustion of gasoline is a chemical  reaction that, like any other chemical reaction, has a specific a  stoichiometric ratio. Remember Chemistry 101, probably not, but you were  told that stoichiometric when referring to combustion is the ratio of  air to fuel at point where the combustion reaction is the most  efficient.  

Now this would all be really cool if we were driving a lean burn  Chrysler, where we were concerned about fuel economy and emissions, and  had a sophisticated computer system to keep it spot on … but the last I  heard… we were trying to tune our engine for the best power…not economy,  and keep it from melting down.  That requires a little richer mixture  ratio of about 12.8 parts air to 1 part fuel, for best power and also  leaves us a safety cushion.

During WOT acceleration EGT will rise to the peak and then start to  decrease after the peak, if we are lean.  We need to control where the  engine runs by controlling the jetting so that we are on the left side  of peak, near the richer ratio of 12.8 to 1 point for best power.  If we  jet at the peak, we will be at the mercy of a lot of load and weather  variables, and without a knock sensor that is tied back to a computer to  adjust the mixture and timing to fix things for us, we could very  easily go lean, which is on the right side of the peak, and be in  meltdown/detonation city… and that isn’t a friendly town to be visiting.

So why don’t we use an air/fuel ratio meter instead of an EGT meter.   First of all you could, and it would work fine.  It’s purely a matter of  cost and durability.  An air/fuel ratio meter with the appropriate wide  band O2 sensor is about 3X the cost of a simple EGT system and really  doesn’t tell us any more than the EGT does.  Sensors tend to deteriorate  due to the higher oil content of a two-stroke exhaust.  Of course…if  you run a multi-cylinder engine then you need a probe and gauge for each  pipe.
Anyone looking for a great builder I highly recommend the following.
For CP products dealers I would recommend:
Arlan at LED(site sponsor), Pete Schemberger at Hybrid Engineering, Mat Shearer at Shearer Custom Pipes, Dennis Packard at Packard Racing, and Nate McCoy of McCoys Peformance.

Other great builders I also would recommend: Neil Prichard, Jerry Hall, Bubba Ramsey and James Dodge.

Offline rsss396

Jetting from the bottom to the Top - Bill Givens
« Reply #2 on: July 31, 2013, 12:12:21 PM »
So… How do we tune using EGT?   It’s really pretty easy to do, if we  remember what we just learned about jetting in general, and how the EGT  works.

EGT should rise rapidly with the RPM as you accelerate and should come  to a point and stay there the time you are at full throttle and a  constant load.  If your EGT rises to a peak and then starts to fall as  you maintain full throttle, you are now on the right (which is the  wrong) side of the curve and lean.  

Normal reading will vary slightly from machine to machine, due to  slightly different probe positions and engine characteristics.  So they  are relative to a certain degree.  When you’re at the peak… you’re at  the stoichiometric ratio of 14.7 to 1 and EGT will typically be in the  neighborhood of 1300°F or so.  Remember that you are looking for a  peak…not a specific number, and this number is relative to your engine  only.  We want to run on the upside of the curve at about 12.8 to 1 and  that will normally be 100°F lower than the peak reading.  

A typical Keihin main jet will change the EGT close to 50°F per jet size  change.    Using this example…let’s say we had a peak of 1300°F running  a 180 main jet.  To drop the temp by 100°F, I would need a main jet  that is 2 sizes larger, and would end up using a 185.   At this setting  your plug and piston reading should show you a great burn pattern and  color.  As you accelerate the EGT should rise quickly to 1200°F and stay  there.  Now that I have the machine jetted spot on… I make note of the  weather conditions, particularly the Air Density and call my baseline a  185 main jet at whatever the AD was.   Let’s say the AD was 92% for my  baseline… it’s getting close to my first heat race so I look at the AD  and see that it’s now 89.5.  What now coach?  I can’t make a few laps  around the track to see what my EGT is, so I need some additional help  to be jetted correctly for the upcoming heat race.  

AD to the rescue!!!  In layman’s terms… air density is a term describing  how dense the air is at any instant of time.  In other words…how much  does the air weigh.  Since the fuel mixture ratio is based on the weight  of the air with respect to the weight of the fuel, it looks like we  might have a valuable factor to help us out with our jetting dilemma.  

Get yourself a mini weather computer station that gives the AD along  with the temperature, humidity and barometric pressure and a whole bunch  of other stuff.  The cost is cheaper than the cost of a top end rebuild  and will pay for itself many times over.  If you use a Relative AD  gauge, remember that it doesn’t take into account the humidity, and  since humidity plays a part in the true AD, you need to know it to find  the true AD or corrected AD.  

AD is directly proportional to barometric pressure and is inversely  proportional to humidity, temperature and altitude.  Simply put…if the  pressure goes up, the AD goes up.  With this increase in AD my jetting  is leaner because I have more air, and I need to install a larger main  jet to get back to the correct air fuel ratio or EGT.  Conversely, if  the humidity or temperature goes up, the AD goes down.  This causes my  jetting to go richer, because I have less air and I need to install a  smaller main jet.  

You’ve heard you wife or girl friend say she was having a bad hair  day…well you’re having a bad air day in racing.  Temperature and  pressure play the largest role in the AD equation.  

Ok… now that I have this super duper info…what do I do with it??   Simple…for every 2.5% increase in AD, you increase your main jet one  size.  In our example several paragraphs above, our AD dropped 2.5%, so I  need to decrease my main jet by one size to get me back in the ball  game.  Make sure to error on the rich side if you’re between numbers.  

During the warm up lap I’ll take a look at my EGT, and if everything is  according to Hoyle, it should be right back up to 1200°F or what ever my  baseline number was…or real close to it.  Now you can race with the  confidence that you jetting is correct and you’ll have the most power  you can for the situation.  It’s really not a complicated as it might  seem reading this, and after you do it a few times it will become old  hat!

Some people like to use a CHT probe along with an EGT probe.  This  method is particularly effective on an air-cooled engine and not as  effective on a water-cooled engine due to the slower rise time of the  water-cooled head temperature.

Some rules of thumb…
EGT and CHT rise together… all is cool
EGT start to fall and CHT rises… you are lean and typically a sign that detonation has set in.
EGT and CHT are both low is a sign of too rich.

Now you have your baseline jetting setup and a plan for making  intelligent jetting decisions.  Make a note of all the weather  information that the jetting info was based upon.

Does it require some back and forth adjustment to get it right  sometimes… yep, but your chances of getting it right the first time are  much better if you go from bottom to top. It’s not unusual for me to  make 5-6 jet changes in a day of racing due to changing conditions. I’ve  found that you can typically make 2-3 main jet changes before you have  to move the needle, but every situation is different.

I have people come up all the time and ask… “What main jet are you  running?” My standard answer over the last 42 years of racing has always  been “Hopefully the right one!” Every engine is different to a certain  degree and every driver/rider is certainly different in their style of  getting around the track or terrain.

What jet works for me, may or may not be right for you in the same  situation. That’s why I never recommend a specific jet unless I know the  history of the engine/rider, and also know what his baseline setup is.
Anyone looking for a great builder I highly recommend the following.
For CP products dealers I would recommend:
Arlan at LED(site sponsor), Pete Schemberger at Hybrid Engineering, Mat Shearer at Shearer Custom Pipes, Dennis Packard at Packard Racing, and Nate McCoy of McCoys Peformance.

Other great builders I also would recommend: Neil Prichard, Jerry Hall, Bubba Ramsey and James Dodge.

 

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