TRX250R.ORG
General => Projects => Topic started by: Pumashine on April 07, 2014, 10:01:48 AM
-
So this is where you post long term projects. This ones so old I believe it was conceived on the old site. I posted pics somewhere of the bottom end I was starting with. Oh well, all is not lost. A year later I get the center cases back from Pete at Hybrid. I had been waiting for 3 years for Calvin at CP industries to cast a small bore saber. It was always on a back burner. So Pete got 2 Saber cylinders from Calvin last year at this time. These are cast as a drag port and do not make good duning machines. So Pete asked Calvin to send the port layouts of the Saber to advanced sleeve. He then modified the port layout to accommodate a dune machine and a super mini tooth drag machine. Pete took this on as a personal project as he wanted a little more power than he had gotten out of Cory's Super Puma now owned by Motofool Will. 6 months later the sleeves had been made and installed. Pete picked up a 5 mill stroker crank from another customer who was not going to use it. All bearings were removed. Tranny sent out for Cryro. The cases were bead blasted and trenched. Filled the area with epoxy to support the cylinder sleeve.
(http://i59.tinypic.com/2ivbteg.jpg)
Gave the cases a bath in lacquer wash and got all sand out of the hidden places. Put on a coat of red polyurethane. This was followed by a red metallic I picked out for this build.
(http://i61.tinypic.com/2iqnz1s.jpg)
(http://i58.tinypic.com/s2a14h.jpg)
-
Very nice Tony, cant wait to see how it turns out for you! Is arlan building you a pipe for it?
-
This will be some nice R eye candy to watch. Looking great puma. I like that red and can't wait to see this build all together.
-
Sweet! Any pics of the top end yet?
-
That metallic coat really made it pop. Who makes that polyurethane paint?
-
Very nice Tony, cant wait to see how it turns out for you! Is arlan building you a pipe for it?
I was going to use a Puma shearer inframe.
Sweet! Any pics of the top end yet?
Pete just sent me the cases back for paint. He will put it together and cut the dome. I don't think I can show any port work as it is highly secret. Maybe just gonna put a coat of silver on the cylinder.
That metallic coat really made it pop. Who makes that polyurethane paint?
The brand is Valspar. It is hard to find.
-
Sweeeet tony!! Man that metallic red is so nice!! You can tell the experience in yours compared to mine. I'll keep practicing. Lol. Can't wait to see the rest of the bike
-
wow! cant wait to see this come together.
john
-
That metallic red is awesome. I wish my frame was that color.
-
At what point during the paint process do you remove those cover plates for the cylinder, side covers, sprocket, clutch actuator, etc.? Do you remove them once each coat sets up for a few minutes or do you cut those once all the coats are set.. or?
-
At what point during the paint process do you remove those cover plates for the cylinder, side covers, sprocket, clutch actuator, etc.? Do you remove them once each coat sets up for a few minutes or do you cut those once all the coats are set.. or?
This is supposed to be asked in the paint thread. But I have not had time to do that one. Once your done painting you need to remove the covers and masking right away before the paint sets up. The cover for the main shaft got left on overnight. Today the main shaft cover was taken off after the paint was hard. Therefore the paint will chip as you break the cover is broken away. I personally like to have that seal and the shifter seal left in place and just mask the seal so no chipping occurs
(http://i61.tinypic.com/3179ymu.jpg)
Went through with a razor blade this morning to remove all the paint that goes around the corner where the gasket sits. Cut some paint away where the motor mounts in the frame. Too much paint or powder leads to fitting problems later on.
-
It's funny you posted this today because just yesterday this came to rest in my shop..
(http://i925.photobucket.com/albums/ad97/4traxman/IMG_1172.jpg) (http://s925.photobucket.com/user/4traxman/media/IMG_1172.jpg.html)
-
thats a older sabertooth cut for a power valve, thats what tony or troy needed on there builds
-
Traxman has been holding out on us.
-
thats a older sabertooth cut for a power valve, thats what tony or troy needed on there builds
Your wrong rsss! It's not even a sabertooth.. :smile-new:
(http://i925.photobucket.com/albums/ad97/4traxman/IMG_1173.jpg) (http://s925.photobucket.com/user/4traxman/media/IMG_1173.jpg.html)
-
Hey Tony, I'm heading up to Pete's this Friday. I'll take stuff up for you if you want me to. By the way those cases look killer. I love the color.
-
I knew that cylinder looked funny for some reason. :)
-
Your wrong rsss! It's not even a sabertooth.. :smile-new:
Of course not its a 187 :lol: That would be great Damon if you would bring the cases up to Pete. You can pick up these base studs for your new project when you come by.
-
Always up to something cool aren't ya!! I love it, this just never ends!!! Great choice on the red too!!!
Thanks Higgy
-
So is that the caracal cylinder, it's obviously set up to be set up on a twin and that would be the clutch side cylinder
very cool
-
I too am going to redo the midrange/MX-Saber project soon...
I'm tuned in here!!! Love the cases and this project...
-
alright Troys back in the game with 2 strokes! cant wait to see it I am sure it will even better than the last masterpiece
-
So is that the caracal cylinder, it's obviously set up to be set up on a twin and that would be the clutch side cylinder
very cool
Yes it's a right side caracal which is basically the same.. I knew you would know if I showed you the other side..
-
They are ready to head to Portland now. Everything else is done Pete says and all he has to do is assemble and then cut the dome.
(http://i61.tinypic.com/16h58op.jpg)
-
that's really nice Tony. awesome job!
-
They are ready to head to Portland now. Everything else is done Pete says and all he has to do is assemble and then cut the dome.
(http://i61.tinypic.com/16h58op.jpg)
Pm me an address.. I'll be by around 10-12 on Friday depending on how long it takes my wife at the two shops she wants to stop by..
-
Pm me an address.. I'll be by around 10-12 on Friday depending on how long it takes my wife at the two shops she wants to stop by..
Thanks Damon for taking it up there for me. Got a call from Pete today. The mini is on its way back from plating. Plan on picking this baby up next weekend. Pete also mentioned there is an alternative to the baby saber. Its the baby Liger. The Liger is popular all around the world and will not be taken over by that lil shop on .net.
-
What engine parts do you breed to get a liger again?
Sent from my LG-P999 using Tapatalk 2
-
Is that the engine theyre running on the 250rs on the Packard web site photo gallery?
-
Is that the engine theyre running on the 250rs on the Packard web site photo gallery?
No those are all the older engines he has done. They consist of the pilot and rotax, and rotax/psi cylinders. The liger is a cr500 based cylinder so some case modification would be required.
-
The liger is cast by cp industries just like the saber,puma and sphinx. Here is a picture of a liger cylinder
(http://i1195.photobucket.com/albums/aa399/honda124/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps92294661.jpg) (http://s1195.photobucket.com/user/honda124/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps92294661.jpg.html)
-
how much are those suckers??
-
I imagine the cylinder is expensive, but the supporting mods probably make the cylinder price seem cheap in comparison.
-
So is that the caracal cylinder, it's obviously set up to be set up on a twin and that would be the clutch side cylinder
very cool
Very close Dave. This was a triple set built for a specific customer that was never completed. Must have been the middle one cause both sides of mine have the flat spot that is machined when they are fit together.
(http://i62.tinypic.com/k9x8vn.jpg)
The cases were sanded to make clearance for the intake manifold section of the cylinder. I am having to build my own intake manifold as there are none small enough to hold the 40mm smartcarb. I have to put a small relief in the manifold to clear the cases
(http://i57.tinypic.com/28cm5j4.jpg)
(http://i62.tinypic.com/2u9jy4m.jpg)
-
I'm not even a big motor guy and I got a boner.
-
sweet. what do you got there ? im not real familiar with the cp stuff
-
sweet. what do you got there ? im not real familiar with the cp stuff
I'm not real sure what it once was, but now it is a mini-tooth 486cc dune motor. These cylinders came off a triple.
(http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c38/Camk/img1239411624980.jpg)
-
Awesome Tony I sure your going to like the power!
-
Awesome Tony I sure your going to like the power!
Have you ever seen anyone make use of the power valve?
-
Have you ever seen anyone make use of the power valve?
But we've all been told a pv is useless above 330 :)
-
But we've all been told a pv is useless above 330 :)
The guy was a freakin genius. I am thinking there is a reason he spent alot of time outfitting these 1200cc motors with power valves. Don't ya think?
-
But we've all been told a pv is useless above 330 :)
when you live in a fairly tale world you can pretend to be anything you want !! :carlos:
which reminds me. every sentance he posts has a "IMO" at the end of it. probly because hes never tested anything himself so he cant answer any question with a factual answer. "IMO" leaves him an escape route out the back door when someone proves him wrong
-
The guy was a freakin genius. I am thinking there is a reason he spent alot of time outfitting these 1200cc motors with power valves. Don't ya think?
I would think so!
I like the pv personally... makes her smooth to ride...
-
I hunted down a used power valve for a saber in Canada, not sure how it ever worked out for him.
i know CP is not going to offer a power valve on the sphynx anymore because of issues of not getting good performance with them. If you could operate it with a electric servo motor and custom cdi to operate it (Ignitech does this) then I think you could make a great running power valve motor the pressure operated ones work ok with snowmobiles because they never use the over rev part of the power band. In over rev the pressure drops in the pipe and the power valve starts to close killing the over rev.
keeping the exhaust port port timing low will build you allot of low end power and is much simpler and reliable
-
................ then I think you could make a great running power valve motor the pressure operated ones work ok with snowmobiles because they never use the over rev part of the power band. In over rev the pressure drops in the pipe and the power valve starts to close killing the over rev..................
YES.....YES.........YES........
It is very refreshing to see others are beginning to see some of the shortcomings of the pressure operated power valves. I started trying to improve on the pressure operated valves on the Rotax road racing engines in the mid 1980s. I gave up after a few years of beating my head against the wall on this primitive method of operating and controlling a two stroke exhaust valve.
-
Video of [MENTION=74]traxman[/MENTION]'s second ever pass on the MiniTooth. Dogged off the line in this one but cleans out nicely. Should be a nice runner when it's tuned.
[video=youtube_share;uc1BVqLPrYc]http://youtu.be/uc1BVqLPrYc[/video]
-
Bike looks strong for its first few passes!
-
lol Look at the smoke trail it leaves!! It was pig rich, but I was too afraid to look back and see.. lol It was the first time on it since last dunefest for one pass besides the couple test hits that resulted in a broken frame. I was a little nervous being @ the line wondering how my repairs where going to hold up. That run was my first pass, the second pass really bogged and my third pass it did really well and carried the front to the 280' area..
-
Yes lots of smoke haha! its tough to run them at the track for the first time, not like racing in the dunes where you just hotlap and make another run if it wasnt good. IMO tuning for the track is differant than the dunes because you need to be on the leaner side so the bike is not loaded up. But in the dunes we like them richer because if racing gets good you just keep hot lapping them.
-
Not me!! I lean it up at the dunes so I have a reason to stop loosing after three races against banshees double my displacement!! Lmao!
-
A thanks to Damon AKA Traxman for giving us a little taste of the power of the mini tooth. He is running an out of frame drag pipe so the angle of the pipe can be adapted easier for the Caracal cylinder. This cylinder was not made for a Honda trx250r. It was intended as a twin or triple on a Banshee. The angle of the exhaust is at least 6 degrees different than a Honda. So heres how a Puma in-frame pipe fits the Caracal.
(http://i61.tinypic.com/f5581z.jpg)
(http://i62.tinypic.com/149qesn.jpg)
Will have to cut a pie shape the same as the wedge space created in the pic. It will just be the opposite (180 degrees) taken off the pipe
The good thing is that this gives me a little room to play with moving the pipe to where it fits the best. Looks like real good kicker clearance.
(http://i58.tinypic.com/15rh7yg.jpg)
Also got just enough room for the coolant line from the back of the cylinder to the clutch cover
(http://i57.tinypic.com/xml5ab.jpg)
-
I cut a piece of metal the same width as the pipe flange so it will clamp in the band-saw. I am going to cut right along a weld. Marked center with a scribe line and some more marks for reference. Set pipe close to perpendicular with the blade and cut.
(http://i58.tinypic.com/nbsokx.jpg)
Hold the pipe like its going to mount
(http://i61.tinypic.com/2hckhzo.jpg)
Them make a mark where the pipe overlaps to get it close to where you want to cut.
(http://i58.tinypic.com/21aye15.jpg)
Using the marks as a guide to sand off the pie shape to get the pipe to fit correctly before tack weld in place.
(http://i57.tinypic.com/15g8lzq.jpg)
-
Man you got it. I'd be scared to start fabbing and hacking lol
Hacking? Thats not what we call it. But OK sure. Took about 3 minutes to sand the header piece.
(http://i58.tinypic.com/23sw861.jpg)
Looking from the top, much better than before. Pipe is centered and clears everything.
(http://i58.tinypic.com/o107t5.jpg)
Now its time to put clearance spacers anywhere the pipe may touch the frame. I like to use 1/8" rubber to flex where it needs to go. Get it where you want it and mark the mating pieces in a few places. Marker tends to rub off. Scribe lines tend to move the pipe around. Then you can take it to the welder and have him tack it in 3 places. Go back and check the fit before welding all the way around.
-
The better way to have done that would have been to use a protractor and measure the angle needed to fix the alignment and then cut the pipe at half that angle. Then turn the pipe flange 180 from where it was, only bad thing is the spring mounts would have to moved also.
The reason it's better to do it this way you only loose the length of the blade width, but it did not look like you removed allot to do your mod so it probably did not hurt anything
-
The reason it's better to do it this way you only loose the length of the blade width
Thanks for the advice Dave. I did take all that into consideration. I needed to take off 3/16"-1/4" on the high side of the pie. I thought about taking 1/2 off both sections. So about 1/8" to nothing on each. What I did not show was the pipe was actually to long to fit into the frame. It was hitting the a-arm mounts that I cut away about 1/4". I lost about 1/8" from front to back as the pipe spring mounts are about centered. The band-saw is .030" thick. Worked out about perfect just doing the pie off the flange (even had clearance on the water hose which has never happened before). After I get the pipe centered with clearance everywhere I can sand the flange a little to make a perfect fit for weld.
What I am saying is since this is not a 250r cylinder it actually worked to my advantage where the exhaust flange ended up. That and Matt's pipes are all a little different. I compared this one to another one I acquired recently. The pipe spring mounts were 1/4"-3/8" further away from the cylinder on this one. So now its perfect as far as I can tell. Just got lucky today.
-
So I got the pipe welded up.
(http://i61.tinypic.com/2004ot2.jpg)
Clears the brake mount
(http://i61.tinypic.com/mikykk.jpg)
Clears the a-arm
(http://i59.tinypic.com/28tkeut.jpg)
In the Smart carb thread Dave suggested mounting the Smart carb to the CR500 intake with an adapter plater I made him. Looks like this.
(http://i870.photobucket.com/albums/ab265/rsss396/ba68e2ed949276f83653703e95005a78_zps6d23b370.jpg)
So I did the same and got this set up!
(http://i59.tinypic.com/ojiiaq.jpg)
So I ready to mount the carb after polishing the adapter plate
(http://i60.tinypic.com/1124apk.jpg)
-
Nice work. !
-
Time to get this monster back on track. Building a stinger to get from Shearer inframe pipe to Cascade silencer. The polished one on top was a fixxed stinger off the ESR 5 big bore pipe. Using a large radius on the new stinger for better air flow.
(http://i62.tinypic.com/e0r4ft.jpg)
-
Exhaust in place
(http://i61.tinypic.com/ajuw46.jpg)
Smart carb had to be reworked as the OEM cr500 intake boot I purchsed new is a lil too long. Fixed the issue by taking the one off my sons CR500 and fitting it on being careful to drill mounting holes a lil higher to lower the whole carb as much as possible. It now clears the frame with lt500 intake boot installed. Thanks to Jared AKA Skeans1 for this idea.
(http://i59.tinypic.com/dm2lja.jpg)
Time to dissemble mock up and paint the frame.
-
I don't have much experience shooting metal flake
(http://i62.tinypic.com/2eumsll.jpg)
Suns too bright to see the flakes but you can see them in the shaded part towards to back in this pic
(http://i60.tinypic.com/2u6z8l4.jpg)
In the sunlight the red is close to Honda red but it is much darker in the shade. This is the color I was aiming for.
(http://i61.tinypic.com/29ztnjb.jpg)
-
is this a dune motor or a drag motor?
-
is this a dune motor or a drag motor?
486 dune motor. Damon has the drag version. Jared may be running at Dune-fest this weekend.
-
Nice job on the paint !!
-
That's gonna be awesome Tony.
-
That's gonna be awesome Tony.
Thanks Doug. I got this +4 stock swinger off ebay a couple years back. I think it will look good with the attempt to bring this bike to look like what it would look like if they were still building them today.
(http://i59.tinypic.com/2nk84eu.jpg)
Pulled the cylinder off while the pipe is being chromed to get the polish work done on it. A little sanding prep work here.
(http://i58.tinypic.com/30c99xg.jpg)
-
What year is the cr500 intake boot?
Thanks Derek.
-
What year is the cr500 intake boot?
Thanks Derek.
The particular one I am using came off a 2001 cr 500. They are supposed to be the same from somewhere around 1997 to 2001. But the new one I got from Honda was a little longer than the one sitting around for the last 15 years. It seems to have shrank about 1/4" in that time.
-
Thanks, the length should be ok for me. I'm using a center mount pipe so I have to use a air box eliminator anyway.
-
I dig the gold swinger, they've grown on me since I left my wife's gold. Are you doing the a-arms the same?
-
something ive found out on them new cr5 intake boots is theyre pretty soft rubber and if the oe clamp is bent even the slightest bit (and even if it isnt bent) it causes a small leak between the boot ID and carb OD. a more sturdy clamp like the style used on the rad valves would work far better i think as they hold a circle shape much better and compress the boot eqaully on the circumference. im in the process of finding something for mine as ive tried everything to keep it from leaking but no luck. tried new oem clamps, tighting it alot and barley tighteneing it. nothing has worked so far. the gemi size 50 like the rad valve is what im going to try and find.
-
Got the pipe back from chrome and the cylinder polished up.
(http://i61.tinypic.com/15xwx38.jpg)
(http://i58.tinypic.com/fjhttt.jpg)
-
looking good
-
Got the pipe back from chrome and the cylinder polished up.
(http://i61.tinypic.com/15xwx38.jpg)
(http://i58.tinypic.com/fjhttt.jpg)
You should try some of those pumashine exhaust hangers, cause your current system looks sketchy...:smug:
-
You should try some of those pumashine exhaust hangers, cause your current system looks sketchy...:smug:
I thought all racing peeps used bungie cords to hold the pipe on. This was temporary as I am building custom hangers for each mount.
-
I thought all racing peeps used bungie cords to hold the pipe on. This was temporary as I am building custom hangers for each mount.
i thought those were the yellow duner powerbands. good for 10hp? looking nice tony...that pipe looks intimidating :newhere:
-
That's gonna look beautiful Tony. Even got yourself a Saber cylinder without the side of big dog turd....excellent
-
That color is sweet tony, that thing's gonna be mean as hell
-
Tony, I might have missed it so sorry in advance.... Why did you paint instead of powder coat???
-
Amazing!
John
-
Tony, I might have missed it so sorry in advance.... Why did you paint instead of powder coat???
I paint my own Polyurethane 3 part paint cause were in the sand and have more color choice. This stuff holds up almost as good as powder. Big bores are notorious for breaking motor mounts. Powder is a bitch to work with doing repairs.
-
Well it looks really good.
-
Exhaust in place
(http://i61.tinypic.com/ajuw46.jpg)
Smart carb had to be reworked as the OEM cr500 intake boot I purchsed new is a lil too long. Fixed the issue by taking the one off my sons CR500 and fitting it on being careful to drill mounting holes a lil higher to lower the whole carb as much as possible. It now clears the frame with lt500 intake boot installed. Thanks to Jared AKA Skeans1 for this idea.
(http://i59.tinypic.com/dm2lja.jpg)
Time to dissemble mock up and paint the frame.
what kind of bike did that snorkel come from?
-
what kind of bike did that snorkel come from?
Suzuki 500 Quadzilla
-
any updates?
-
any updates?
Sure wish I had time to work on the bikes. I did see this in QOTM today. Makes me want to build an aluminum airbox to fit the LT500 boot.(http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g275/Ct350trx/11292974_922378867783078_1471241243_n_zpscq62qvge.jpg) (http://s58.photobucket.com/user/Ct350trx/media/11292974_922378867783078_1471241243_n_zpscq62qvge.jpg.html)
-
tony, any news on your build?
John