TRX250R.ORG
Workshop => Engine and Bottom End => Topic started by: broken1 on July 21, 2013, 04:06:51 PM
-
We recently picked up an 86trx for my wife & I've been going through it to make sure everything's good. The previous owner used atf in the trans & I was wanting to change to honda 80w/85w. Will this hurt the clutch fiber's? Should I remove them & clean them real good than soak them in the honda gear oil before running the bike? Thanks in advance for any help.
-
I think you can just change over and be fine.atf is more abrasive than the other oil .it keeps everything sweaky clean.lots of people run atf but I would guess there clutch life isn't as great.years ago a tranny man at a shop I worked at showed me that his hands that had no calis on them from working with tranny fluid all day
-
I switched from the red bottle to HP4. Did a good ride after switching then changed it again,all was good!
-
Hummm, let me see, close to 25 years using Dexron ATF in the R trans & in all those years busted one gear, wasnt from the oil though.
ATF is perfect for the fiber clutch plates & the right thickness for all of the bearings & seals. Only thing, it needs changing after every event just to have clean oil inside the trans.
Neil
WOAH, this is different, my reply is at the top ???.
-
Gotta agree with Neil, been using ATF in all my 2 strokes for years, just gotta change it often because of the detergents in it, it dirties fast. Never had an issue with premature clutch wear of gear failure. I use Type F though.
-
Shucks, I've used Dexron ATF from the Dollar Store many times, I mean like its not going to be in there but one race weekend & then fresh at the next race.
Neil
-
My buddy was sponsored by Penzoil back in the day,he had cases of that stuff. After every TT heat he would change it..lol
-
I recently started running ATF in my drag bike and have no problems. I still run honda red bottle in my other r. But as stated ATF has to be changed more
-
Thanks for all the info guys. I used to run dumonde tech(my source stopped carrying it) in my 86 & it's light weight just like atf. After reading all the replies I think I'll just put atf back in my wife's bike because I change the oil in mine after every weekend dune trip anyways so one more bike to change is no big deal. Thanks again fellas.
-
I have always ran Motul Trans-oil since like 1993 with no problems.
-
The guys on the cr500 forum turned me on to a premium tractor fluid designed for tractors with wet clutches in their gear boxes and it has been working great.
You get 5 gallons for something like 60.00 I have used 4 gallons already in 2 years since I change mine after every trip.
-
I used to work at a Transmission shop, and have rebuilt numerous trans. The 250r clutch is very similar to a automatic trans. Wet clutches, gears, bearings etc. If it works for my F250 pulling 10k with trans temps in the 220's it will work for my R for 8hrs of riding during a dune trip.
ATF is what I am talking about.
-
When I bought my CR250, first ride I just ran what kid had in the tranny cuz he said he just changed it. Clutch dragged, couldnt start it in gear...thought ok need a clutch. Wanted to ride next weekend so just tryed ATF, clutch got well,... good as new. Im sold on ATF in 2stroke trannys. Jim
-
I've heard of alot of people using ATF with good results, but have to change it all the time. I have been using Amsoil's Formula 4-stroke 0w-40 for several years now and it seems to work great. I started racing at the beginning of the year, and honestly, I don't have to change it that often. The oil doesn't get dirtied up or have particles in it very quickly. I have great clutch engagement and go several races and fluid still looks good. I have changed it a couple of times in the past thinking surely it should be ready to be changed by now, and empty the fluid and it still looks a light golden honey color with very little amount of particles in it. It is more expensive than ATF, but it keeps me from having to change it very often and it protects the gears very well. Just my 2 cents.
-
ATF looks like it is much dirtier quicker than other oils is because it is. It has detergents in the oil which cleans gunk off of stuff which is then suspended within the oil.
Ever hear of someone adding a quart of ATF to a cars engine oil before they do an oil change? Same type of thing going on.
-
Rupp250, you are correct. ATF is a natural detergent. Alot of people don't realize this, but so is synthetic oil.
-
i have discovered 75w to improve clutch action and feels like smoother shifts. i have neils upgrade if that is any consequence.
john
-
I've caught a little flak on the other site for stating I use atf in a pinch. Glad to see people putting serious time on engines running atf proving it's perfectly fine to run.
-
Was just looking in my service manual and it says 4 stroke oil or equivalent. Viscocity is 10w-40 for the transmission. Im kind of confused on why the 80w/85w would be also used in the transmission (as recommended on the bottle for 2 strokes and 4) with obviously a large change in viscosity. Unless im missing something here.
-
I use Honda HP4 10/40 in mine,same as what the 450r's use.
-
All of the above work, including the tractor fluid which is supposed to work quite well actually, but I haven't tried it. Regardless of what you run, change it often,especially the atf. Oil is cheap insurance for your motor.
-
Thats right, when you change often, your cleaning out the junk from everything moving around, scrubbing on each other & none of the junk needs to run through the bearings. At least changing your halfway keeping the junk out of those bearings.
Neil
-
I have been using Dumonde Tech oils since the late 1980's. Dumonde Tech oil starts with the highest quality base stocks and uses better (expensive) additive packages. In oi,l the the additive package is the highest expense and the most important factor in protecting parts. When you buy oil a good percentage of the cost goes to marketing and advertising. Because Dumonde Tech does almost no advertising when you buy their oil you are paying just for a better oil. Dumonde Tech is providing us all with a level of oil technology we could not buy unless we had inside factory connections.
I could carry and number of oils that would be more profitable to my business. I use only Dumonde Tech, because it protects my customers investment better than other products. Vintage machines like TRX 250R's have many parts that are practically irreplaceable. I suggest that running cheaper oil on oil is not the place to save money.
-
i recently switched to running regular universal synthetic atf after reading on here and was really suprised how much crud that came out of the tranny on the first 2 oils changes now it seems that my son can get a week or more of riding in the fields and mine dumps near our house before i see any discoloration in the oil so now we are changing the tranny oil about every tank and a half to 2 tanks of gas in stead of every tank using belray gearsaver. but this is not racing conditions or wot all the time either mainly just play riding around the house. i use to use rotella 15w-40 for years and never once had any issues but thats when i had it readily available as i worked at a truck service garage. for now the atf is working well. edit im back to running rotella 15w40 i always have it and its never failed me.
-
I have been using Dumonde Tech oils since the late 1980's. Dumonde Tech oil starts with the highest quality base stocks and uses better (expensive) additive packages. In oi,l the the additive package is the highest expense and the most important factor in protecting parts. When you buy oil a good percentage of the cost goes to marketing and advertising. Because Dumonde Tech does almost no advertising when you buy their oil you are paying just for a better oil. Dumonde Tech is providing us all with a level of oil technology we could not buy unless we had inside factory connections.
I could carry and number of oils that would be more profitable to my business. I use only Dumonde Tech, because it protects my customers investment better than other products. Vintage machines like TRX 250R's have many parts that are practically irreplaceable. I suggest that running cheaper oil on oil is not the place to save money.
I completely agree with this. Quality oil is worth the money. The additive packages is where the proprietary part of different oil companies come into play. Oil companies have access to the same quality base stocks available to purchase. However, the additives put in the oil are the secret concoctions that each oil company has come up with to make that oil better suited for it's design purpose. This of course takes alot of money, time, and research. This is why you pay a premium for certain oils. Very few times, if ever, does an oil or lubricant only have one purpose. Even with trans oil, the lubricant should be able to:
have a strong enough film strength to keep all gears, bearings, etc, lubricated to prevent wear
condition clutch materials to allow maximum hook up with minimal slippage or glazing
condition seals to prevent seepage
have anti foaming agents
have high temperature additives to prevent thinning under high temp high rpms
provide rust protection
I realize that not everyone expects all this from their trans oil or event cares, but this is what I expect out of mine.