Cylinder heat caused by pipe

[Pumashine]

My welding guru's won't work on used pipes. I always have to get new ones and modify. Some guys can weld anything and do not care about the carbon build up. I suggest going with someone that has experience with used pipes.

[F-Red]

Thanks for the info. Dave. I've got some phone calls to make.

[F-Red]

My welding guru's won't work on used pipes. I always have to get new ones and modify. Some guys can weld anything and do not care about the carbon build up. I suggest going with someone that has experience with used pipes.

Thanks Tony.

[etccb]

Maybe I missed it but what size is your engine again f-red?

[Pumashine]

That was in the ESR330 failure thread. Carlos claims a bigger stinger is a band aid to the real problem. But problems are real and Carlos's claims are unreal. The people that spent money on a poor cast are just looking for a way to make it work. You can only learn from mistakes whether you made them or someone else did.

[etccb]

Wasn't sure of engine size and true larger stinger less heat help but I remember now and less ex side heat help from the large stinger would't hurt that's for sure. With his ex side water jacket mod and a stinger mod f-red sure addressed any possible help in that ex side area. Neither would be a step back and could only help, not hurt.

[Bowtie316]

I have been watching this thread but wan't able to join until now.  I have a ESR 330+4 mil, not sure if it has the cooling passage mod or not (will verify that tonight) and I'm going to run a trx-5 pipe and ESR silencer but I am unsure if this stinger/silencer size mod is needed or warranted for a 344.  I don't really plan to hold it wide open for long periods of time, but I'm sure it will have to endure a few 2nd through 5th gear drag races.  Would you all recommend going from 1-1/8 od to 1-1/4 od for my situation?

I have already ordered the bends, straight pipe and perforated tube to replace stinger and modify the silencer.  Will this affect the power delivery of the motor?  It has a "mid-top dune port", will a larger stinger give up some power somewhere?

If it's warranted for a 344, I will do it and post pictures and results.

[C-Leigh Racing]

Regardless of the engine size, theres no use in holding back heat in a pipe for a normal everyday rider, not unless that is part of the tuning your doing on the engine. Some builders will use the pipe heat, in order to speed up the wave travel inside, but it only changes it very little.
Best thing to do, have a stinger the proper size for the bore & stroke & then if you need some pipe heat, start wrapping the pipe with exhaust wrap till its the tune your after.
The stingers more or less a bleed off for pressure in the pipe, so why hold it back, let the pipe work.

Hey Tony, them welding gurus, probably just saying that instead of saying they dont want to mess with it in the first place. One of those dollar things you know.
Always remember, if made or done in the USA, it somehow will have a dollar connected to it, unless you have respect for others & then you'll just about give it away.
Japan, China or those cross the big pond countrys, those people will do it for free, time & time again just to honor their country.

Barter, now thats a way to go.
Neil

[rsss396]

If you want a half way point on your increased stinger size, then cut off the 1-1/8 tail pipe 1" from the end of the pipe, take a die grinder and clean any weld disturbing flow on the inside of the 1" long stinger still on the pipe.
Slip your new 1-1/4" stinger over the 1-1/8",  1" long piece and weld your new 1-1/4 stinger and silencer on the bike.
This will put you half way between a stock 1-1/8" stinger and a larger 1-1/4" stinger

[Bowtie316]

Regardless of the engine size, theres no use in holding back heat in a pipe for a normal everyday rider, not unless that is part of the tuning your doing on the engine. Some builders will use the pipe heat, in order to speed up the wave travel inside, but it only changes it very little.
Best thing to do, have a stinger the proper size for the bore & stroke & then if you need some pipe heat, start wrapping the pipe with exhaust wrap till its the tune your after.
The stingers more or less a bleed off for pressure in the pipe, so why hold it back, let the pipe work.

Hey Tony, them welding gurus, probably just saying that instead of saying they dont want to mess with it in the first place. One of those dollar things you know.
Always remember, if made or done in the USA, it somehow will have a dollar connected to it, unless you have respect for others & then you'll just about give it away.
Japan, China or those cross the big pond countrys, those people will do it for free, time & time again just to honor their country.

Barter, now thats a way to go.
Neil

10-4 Neil, thanks for your input. The way I was looking at it, I increased the engine displacement from ~250cc to ~344cc, thats a 37.6% increase. A stinger size increase from 1" id to 1=1/8 id is only a 27% increase in cross sectionctional area. To me, logically thinking, it would work. I just don't want to get into a situation where it causes it to be a dog down low or something.

I'm going clean the inside and outside of my pipe real well, possibly bake it, then back purge with argon.  I hope it works out okay.

[udontknowme]

That was in the ESR330 failure thread. Carlos claims a bigger stinger is a band aid to the real problem. But problems are real and Carlos's claims are unreal. The people that spent money on a poor cast are just looking for a way to make it work. You can only learn from mistakes whether you made them or someone else did.

you think carlos knows anything. check every alky thread over there. he dont reply 1 time. but if someone asks how to clean a airfilter he chimes in immediatly. that tells me alot right there

[chrisr]

10-4 Neil, thanks for your input. The way I was looking at it, I increased the engine displacement from ~250cc to ~344cc, thats a 37.6% increase. A stinger size increase from 1" id to 1=1/8 id is only a 27% increase in cross sectionctional area. To me, logically thinking, it would work. I just don't want to get into a situation where it causes it to be a dog down low or something.

I'm going clean the inside and outside of my pipe real well, possibly bake it, then back purge with argon.  I hope it works out okay.

Purging the pipe would be a good thing to do.  It would help keep the backside of the weld smooth and droop free.

[Pumashine]

If you want a half way point on your increased stinger size, then cut off the 1-1/8 tail pipe 1" from the end of the pipe, take a die grinder and clean any weld disturbing flow on the inside of the 1" long stinger still on the pipe.

You would be surprised to see how much weld is blocking the stinger at the weld 1" back. Another place of concern is where the pipe is bent around the frame. Many of these bends allow the round shape to become oval there fore decreasing the area of the round shape. I have seen pipe only 3/4" apart at the bend.

[rsss396]

The entry to the stinger is actually a very important part of the pipe, much more than allot of people believe.
Some people place such high regards to its importance that they machine a piece of round stock to transition the end of the pipe to the stinger and move the weld away from the entry, some also create nozzles that taper down the back out within a larger stinger.
The nozzle is sized for proper back pressure, actually FMF has done similar but less fancy restrictions on some of their pipes to create this nozzle effect.

[Bowtie316]

The entry to the stinger is actually a very important part of the pipe, much more than allot of people believe.
Some people place such high regards to its importance that they machine a piece of round stock to transition the end of the pipe to the stinger and move the weld away from the entry, some also create nozzles that taper down the back out within a larger stinger.
The nozzle is sized for proper back pressure, actually FMF has done similar but less fancy restrictions on some of their pipes to create this nozzle effect.

I wondered about how to go about the transition.  It looks like ESR used the cone to form the entry into the stinger and swelled the stinger to fit over the top for a lap-joint weld.  I planned to cut the weld out and see what was underneath. I guess I will wait to see what it looks like when I cut it apart before I decide how to go about it.  I can mimic what ESR did, but I'm not sure what the minimum diameter should be.