Author Topic: counter balancer bolts talk... (Read 5893 times)

sameltoe · « **on:** October 31, 2013, 06:20:30 PM »

So I went to honda after finding my counter balancer holder was broken, installed a hinson holder. Well the previous owner put some make shift crap in their. Well as we all know the factory stuff is discontiued, so my dealership just ordered the correct length bolts. Eventually I will probly go the titanium route but as a quick order/fix I went with honda...

Question is...are the oem counter balancer bolts hardened? 1of the 3 are still available. The 1 that is available still, has a 10mm head and a 10 stamped in it. Which usually means a "hardness" of a grade 10.
The 2 longer bolts are just a 8mm head and look like normal honda bolts.

These are the honda numbers they gave me:

6x25 - 95710-0602507
6x100 - 96001-0610000
6x110 - 96001-0611000

Do you guys think I would be ok runnin the regular bolts that they found? Or should I scrap riding sunday and order the titanium?

Outlaw525 · « **Reply #1 on:** October 31, 2013, 07:51:33 PM »

Esr has the 3 bolt on the web sight they are Allan and stainless. That is where I got mine they worked good

mennis1971 · « **Reply #2 on:** October 31, 2013, 08:11:13 PM »

If you can find the bolts anywhere then I say go ride. The long one is the one I'd be most worried about. That one breaks and you'll be splitting cases. Yes I've had that one break once.

jcs003 · « **Reply #3 on:** October 31, 2013, 08:25:08 PM »

they arent really in shear and have no tension on them so as long as its quality hardware you shouldnt have any worries.

john

mennis1971 · « **Reply #4 on:** October 31, 2013, 08:30:20 PM »

Sam it may have been the top sprocket guard bolt that broke that I'm thinking of, but I think that both of those bolts(one of the CB holder and def the top sprocket guard bolt) bolt into the other case half. I broke one of those(IDK which, I've owned my R for a long time but I'm pretty sure it was the CB one) and had to split the case to get some of the bolt out. I got lucky though, it came out VERY easily by hand.

Pumashine · « **Reply #5 on:** October 31, 2013, 08:55:51 PM »

The original 100 and 110 bolts had a 8mm head. They were replaced by the ones with the 10mm head. Anything will work. Torque them them 5 to 6 ft-lbs. The longer ones do stretch. I use a 1/4 drive ratchet putting them on so I don't over tighten them. I have not used the stainless ones but that looks like a good alternative.

The 100mm one is also the same one used on the case saver. I thought they were still available.

Edit: Use of locktite should be use on the rest of the bolts on the stator side not the CB bolts.

matt250r21 · « **Reply #6 on:** November 01, 2013, 09:51:55 AM »

I have a few of those OE counterbalance carrier bolts if anyone needs them. I replaced mine with Titanium bolts on both my engines.

C-Leigh Racing · « **Reply #7 on:** November 01, 2013, 09:57:05 AM »

The bad thing about those two bolts, is using them over & over, in & out & after a while those long bolts will give out & break.
The best thing that will last the longest, is a stud & a flange nut, but they are hard to find. With the stud, your only twisting the end of the stud with tightening the nut, which is very little twist at all, so not much strain on that stud. A grade 8 will be just fine.

Normally when that long bolt breaks, it will be right at the end of the threads where it will snap & most of the time, you can take a pocket screwdriver & turn whats left of the bolt out.
When it does break, if you remove the long part of what is left of the bolt, put something back in that hole like silicone to seal it up, cause that little piece of bolt can jiggle & wiggle until it comes out & guess what it will stick to, yep you guessed it, those magnets on that flywheel & we all know what a new CR250R ignition sells for.
Lock~tite is good for a bunch of things, but those two bolts, if you put it on them, the pocket screwdriver trick wont work & only thing you can do is when the cases are split, its milling machine to get that bolt end out & heli~coil to fix it back.
Neil

Jerry Hall · « **Reply #8 on:** November 02, 2013, 02:11:16 AM »

We used to find the long counter balancer bolt broken on a lot of new engines as well as engines that we had rebuilt. We started replacing the long bolt with a new OEM bolt any time we rebuilt an engine and torqued it to the correct spec. We have not found any broken bolts on our rebuilt engines since we started replacing and torquing the long bolt.

rsss396 · « **Reply #9 on:** November 03, 2013, 07:30:00 AM »

we put some silicone around the bolt in case it decided to break, that way if it would break the silicone would hold it in place.

seemed like all the bolts we did that to never broke, maybe it had a dampening effect like putting a rubber hose on a spring.

All250R · « **Reply #10 on:** December 05, 2013, 02:21:33 AM »

Quote from: rsss396;16371

we put some silicone around the bolt in case it decided to break, that way if it would break the silicone would hold it in place.

seemed like all the bolts we did that to never broke, maybe it had a dampening effect like putting a rubber hose on a spring.

I believe the case will hold it in place becuase it tends to snap from what I think is torsional stess around the case half gasket, or basically where the threads end. I run Ti bolts in my personal engine, but with other people's engines, I'll add a little antiseize to the underside of the head flange and work the clamping tension in the bolt back and forth with the ratchet to try to relieve the torsional stress form that long bolt shaft...

rsss396 · « **Reply #11 on:** December 05, 2013, 08:20:22 AM »

Quote from: All250R;19152

I believe the case will hold it in place becuase it tends to snap from what I think is torsional stess around the case half gasket, or basically where the threads end. I run Ti bolts in my personal engine, but with other people's engines, I'll add a little antiseize to the underside of the head flange and work the clamping tension in the bolt back and forth with the ratchet to try to relieve the torsional stress form that long bolt shaft...

My very first 250R which I bought used in 94 ran for about 5 min on it first time out before the broken bolt was attracted by the magnets inside the flywheel and then proceeded to destroy my stator coils, I am sure that had it broke before I had bought it and I am sure without the seller knowing, I never thought of pulling the stator cover off before taking out riding for the first time since it was a clean maintained bike.
After talking with the brother in-laws who had both bought 250r's new in 86 , told me about the silicone trick and we just guessed that maybe some sort of dampening effect was happening. either way the broken bolt was something that they had seen but after using the silicone the problem never happened again.
It was easy enough to do so, it became a part of our rebuild process